0:06  
Hello, and welcome to the green mind podcast. I'm your host, Leandra Lacey. For those of you that did not already know me, I am a social conservationist. That means I work at the intersection of environmental and social sciences. I've been able to love and enjoy this space since 2007. And now I want to bring that space to you. I will be interviewing people around the world and understand the connection between human wellbeing and environmental outcomes. My hope is that you will find a way to engage in this space, we all have a role to play in the health of our communities and the planet. Let's see who's up next for today's interview.

0:53  
All right,

0:54  
welcome back. I'm so excited. I have the man Jason swan. here with us today.

1:04  
You know, if you're going to do something like that, I love it. You know, I am the man.

1:14  
What are you trying to say?

1:16  
Bob, so happy to be here. Thanks for having me. Leander. You know, we go way back. Yeah, way back to what last year,

1:22  
last year, beginning of last year. Yeah. But it feels like forever, though, in a good

1:27  
way, in a good way. 2020 was five years combined. So I feel like we've known each other for five years. So. Okay, you're right.

1:35  
I mean, I'm so excited to have you here today. Jason, I mean, for so many reasons. But for number one reason for me is being in Colorado, and just finding a brother who understands and is engaged in conservation, sustainability, but your own spin to it. Whenever I'm hanging out with you, my listeners, y'all know how I feel about this sort of stuff, I can just let my hair down. I'm using phrase, I feel like it. I can just be like, I'm back home and talking to my brothers, sisters, cousins, uncle, whatever, I don't have to worry about anything, I can just be myself it slowly is the only way to

2:11  
be is the only way to be, I feel like your friendships if they don't give you peace, and allow you to really be truly who you want to be, especially in the time of need. Me, I got to do enough code switching all my jobs and everywhere else. Like I don't want to do that.

2:31  
I'm trying to minimize that even even at the workspace, like you know what, why am I code switching, you know, but you can't help it. Sometimes it's ingrained as part of who you are, as part of the society that you grew up in so that you were trained to code switch all facts.

2:45  
But

2:46  
let's get into what we do every single time when I met you, when you invited me to be a part of your organization. The way that you kick it off, I want to kick it off for you in this way, mind, heart and body. So what's the rules were mind heart and body for those who might want to use this in the future?

3:02  
Yeah, so my heart and body is a great coke counseling session, right? There's a participant and there's a counselor, the counselors, the listener, they listen with intention, they don't listen to judge, they don't listen to solve your problem. They can be in agreement, what they can do, essentially, is to motivate an emotional release from the participant. And that's what you can do only is to encourage emotional release. So whether that's happiness, sadness, anger, whatever it is, encourage that. Yeah. So you go through three steps, which is mine, whatever your mind feels, whatever you want to speak on, you speak on it, whatever your heart feels, you speak on it, whatever your body feels, you speak on it, and I don't care what it is. But my job is to shut the hell up and listen, and encourage your emotional releases.

3:55  
I love it. I love it. And so we kick off all of our meetings in this way. So I want to bring that to my listeners today. Feel free to incorporate it, you know, and we've done it with people that you wouldn't expect to do it with, you know, like funders and donors and other people. And it really does invite you to really have a deeper connection with the person that you're about to go into a meeting with us.

4:15  
Yes, because too often, we go into our meetings with this intention to talk business and to get right to business without humanizing the experience first, and we need to be able to humanize our experiences, because one is just going to connect us with who that person is and actually what they're dealing with. And again, it just really allows that sanctuary for you to say, Look, I'm dealing with real stuff.

4:43  
Thank you

4:49  
know, they say when you start cursing, you actually are speaking real true honest. I'm gonna try my best to stay away from that. But anyway. All right.

4:59  
Well, you You know, could we could spend the whole episode just doing my heart and bias? Let's get into it. We'll make it quick. So I guess I will kick it off, I'll be the one that everyone has to listen to first. So, mind, so my mind is feeling okay. I mean, it is thinking about COVID-19 is thinking about the vaccinations is thinking about just all that relief that's going to come from that, while at the same time stressed out about the people who aren't going to believe in the vaccine who aren't ready for it, you know, while at the same time appreciating black and brown bodies, stories about the fact that they are medically used in the past, and that they don't want to be used again in this situation where they're being like guinea pigs for medical, you know, medical issues. And so sometimes people forget about those stories, like, oh, why are these people not into it? Like, no, they're not, they're not into it, there's a history of being abused in the medical profession for black and brown bodies, and that needs to be acknowledged, whereas other people just don't believe in science. And that's a whole different story. So that's my mind is kind of, you know, back and forth on that. On my heart, let's see, I mean, you know, I know, you know, cuz

6:08  
we talk about

6:09  
it. Well, not, I mean, with my heart, I had met somebody, I have met somebody recently. And you know, it feels good to not be alone right now, especially in the world where we're so alone and isolated. And it's so weird to find a connection, we'll say it for now. Because, you know, I'm not trying to go too deep into it, right to find a connection. amidst this chaos seems almost impossible. But somehow it happens. I'm really happy about that. Because for our human well being, we all need people in our lives in some way or other and to have this extra deeper connection is really fantastic. So that's hard. That's hard. And then body. You know, I think the thing I tried to bring up a lot is last summer, I did a vegan. And now I was calling myself flexitarian. But the majority of my food is vegan, I love cooking vegan food. It's just fun. I'm only doing it for the health reasons, I'm not doing it for all the other amazing reasons that one might be vegan as well. And so I'm just trying to find some more recipes out there that really satisfies my cravings. I love to cook and I don't like the fact that I'm so new to vegan cooking that I don't know what to cook. So I need more recipes in my life. So the listeners if you're out there and you have a great recipe, just post it somewhere, go on the Instagram, the green mind podcast and just put in some recipes from some vegan recipes that I might enjoy. Alright, that's me. I'm gonna stop right there

7:38  
today. Now, usually after my heart body, you have to give a gratitude. What are you grateful for?

7:43  
Oof, Oof.

7:45  
So I you know what I am grateful for my spiritual journey that I'm on right now. religion and spirituality has been a big part of who I am growing up and who I am right now. And I feel like the spiritual journey I'm on right now so strong and I feel so connected to it. I have a spiritual director who is amazing. Her name is Karen Huebner a car is not a other Karen.

8:18  
The other carriers I love you I got Karen friends, you know I love you. But not like Karen. Karen, do you know what I'm talking about?

8:23  
Bobby, Bobby, Bobby compare that to barbecue but she got

8:31  
she called them cops.

8:33  
I am very grateful for that. And you know, it's nice to connect in a very spiritual way. And I'm very grateful for that.

8:39  
That's amazing. Thank you so much for sharing. And I resonate a little without that, particularly the vegan food. I'm not a vegan. However, I have a very, very good vegan fan will admin. You can find him on Instagram. But if I should definitely make sure that you get in touch with him. He is a chef. Oh, you can chef. Oh, pretty sure he will get you right.

9:02  
All right, I'm down, please.

9:06  
Alright, so I will actually tell people if you do my heart body, maybe try to like meditate for like two minutes before you get into it because just jumping into it. Sometimes you're not even ready. But I was ready today. So mine is all over the place. Okay. There are so many responsibilities that I have encountered over the last year and have accepted that my plate is full. And I am trying to manage multiple projects and trying to get things done but get things done in an efficient way and quality way. So I'm not just giving out crap work. Yeah, and I'm also trying to re examine what is important to me and what I should and should not be working on and so that is important to me as well as I move into 2021 is really taking out as trash. That doesn't necessarily, you know, I don't need to have. So that is my mind My body is I'm just going to skip heart and go to body. I'm gonna do heart though. But body is I, you know what I'm healthy, you know, I eat really healthy. I work out because I'm in the mountains constantly, we'll get into that. So body is doing actually pretty good, I do want to add a little bit more weight. So I've always struggled with my weight, because I have a very high metabolism. So I'm looking to add more weight somehow. But we'll see how that goes.

10:35  
You can take plenty of mine If Hey, you know.

10:41  
And my heart, much like you, I am just intrigued, infatuated by a particular soul one, and I'm just trying to see where this will go and not to get myself over excited. Even though it's hard, because you're human, like, you just want to be excited, you want to just give it your all you want to go for it. But your experiences have taught you to slow down your experiences. And your life lenses have taught you to maybe just take it one step at a time. And so I'm trying to follow what has traditionally been a very smart idea to do, and not get too overwhelmed by the possibility of love. Mm hmm. So, here I am. And as far as gratefulness man, I am just grateful that I have met and starting to be part of communities in Colorado, that are making true change. And that is exciting. You know, when you can start talking to representatives, you can start talking to just friends are just very involved. And not only the outdoor industry, but just politics in general and policy. It's amazing to see black and brown folks out and about doing that type of work. And we need more of them. And yeah, I'm excited that I'm one of the few as you are that are actually working in Colorado to make a difference.

12:00  
Yeah, yeah. Absolutely. And, you know, mind, heart and body is so perfect to get into why we're even here because of rising routes. I mean, you can't even

12:14  
the raw

12:16  
routes. Yes,

12:18  
that's it. That's what we're here for today. People let's talk about let's get into it. So, Jason, you are founder CEO, tell me your title today. What is rising routes? I mean, I know what it is. But everyone needs to know what rising routes is.

12:34  
Yeah, you know, rising routes has been around for quite some time, y'all three years now. But we've been working in the background trying to figure out exactly who we are. And that has been the difficult part. Because we started off as an outdoor organization. At one point just to get people from different backgrounds or different life lenses to be able to show more empathy on the trails, and learn from each other, through this program that we use, and I'm gonna give them a shout out to is called 365 meaningful conversations. And it's like a cart system where you ask provoking deep questions to really get to know someone outside of just, you know, this surface level type of conversation. And we wanted to do that on the trail, right? Because we felt like the outdoors was our sanctuary and the place where all things can heal, and all things or open and vulnerability is shone upon. And so that was essentially the idea when we first started. And the reason and I'll just go just a little bit step back to before I get into that shoe of what rising routes is prior, you know, I had an issue happen to me, in Nebraska, where I was wrongfully charged and convicted, not convicted.

13:51  
I was wrongfully beat up and charged for an assault on an officer, which never occurred. But when that happened, and I was facing upwards of 10 years in prison, which is crazy to even think about. Yeah. And I had to spend about what a year fighting the system because God forbid you take it to court, right? They don't want you to take it to trial. No, they want you to plead down. And that's what I had to do to be able to get out of this situation, right. And so that changed my entire perspective on life. I woke me up to the disparities of the judicial system, and really led me into the place where I am today. But rising routes where I was like, you know, people just don't know each other. The reasoning behind that cops frustration or his biases, or whatever the case that you want to call it, because he just didn't know who I was. He saw what he perceived to be a thug. But all actuality I was a person who had eight years of experience in the financial industry, and I was a contributor to my community even when I was in Nebraska. So when that happened, I realized there needed to be a change. So I wanted to give some context there.

14:59  
I love that I love that story. And it really reminds me I talk a lot about to folks that, you know, I get that we talked about the police force and that whole history, and there's a history there. And I will say there are good cops out there. I know some amazing ones out there. But there's some really bad ones too. But at the same time, what I see going on a lot is if I were to go into my black community, and I see someone with a hoodie, I'm like, Oh, that's my cousin. That's money. That's my uncle. You know, that's like someone I know. That's my friend. Like, I know the difference between a hoodie. And that my cousin, my friend and a hoodie. I'm like, Oh, I'm gonna avoid that person, because that person actually is up to no good. But I know the difference, because I grew up in that that's an everyday experience for me. Of course, I would know. And if you are not from that community, how would you possibly know? Who's is the good one? And who was the bad one? No different than if I were to go into an all white community. And I was like, oh, that person's wearing camo. What does that mean? Am I gonna get shot today? Like, trench coat? Or a trench coat? What does that trench coat mean? I don't know. But if you're a white person in that white community, you're like, Oh, that's just Uncle Tom, Johnny. And you know, that person's doing that. And he's just going hunting and oh, that trenchcoat. That's like a cool fashion statement he's into right now. But it doesn't mean he's gonna bomb up that place. Right? I can't differentiate faces and expressions in a white community. No different than a white person cannot identify expressions in the black community because they didn't grow up in it.

16:29  
Yep. And there you go. And that's gets me to rise new routes, right. So I co founder rising routes with shout out mateesah Gerais shout out Marina Bay, co founded rising rails with her. And the organization is essentially laying a foundation at the intersection of environmental stewardship, right. Social Justice and mental health. Stop it. I know, right? By creating a single solutions that mutually it has holistically work to solve all three simultaneously. Hmm, hey, look, when I say that, I can see people faces. I don't even see him. And if I would say How the hell did you plan on doing that? Well, you know, it's tough. It's hard. And that's why I had to convene a group of people to be able to work on this with me, so I'm not alone. Leanna Lacey is that guy, he worked with me, along with Mary McCain, who works with the National Park Service. Yes. And a few other people that I'm not going to mention yet because I'm waiting for them to come back on board. But at rides and routes, we're using the outdoors. That is our platform, that is our sanctuary, that is a medium to build community. and facilitate approachable dialogue, right, approachable dialogue around environmental conservation, justice, equity, diversity, and inclusion, right, the Jetta and personal wellness topics, right? We're committed to like building a very strong network of change making organizations that can leverage expertise about like yourself and bring our collective values and goals to fruition. And so, you know, essentially, we just want to be able to have what we call co contributors or foster a community of CO contributors ready to address oppressive systems to help heal the planet and ourselves.

18:27  
Mmm

18:28  
hmm. That's a lot of work.

18:31  
Yeah, absolutely. It's

18:32  
a lot of work. But you know what, though? Someone's got to do it. You know, someone's got to try and make an effort.

18:38  
What like I will say to Mary sent me a card in the mail. I don't know if she sent you want, but special? Yeah, I didn't get one.

18:47  
I'm gonna talk to you Mary.

18:53  
Oh, that's funny.

18:56  
marries me a car and she talked about this Hummingbird is apparently it was some story where essentially this forest was burning down and all the animals were retreating and retreating retreating. But there's one Hummingbird this one Hummingbird he was going he was you know, everybody's watching him he's you know, all the animals this Hummingbird was going to affect a little water and he was sprinkling it on the fire. He'll go back do it again. He was just relentless, right? just kept doing it kept doing it. You know, everybody looking at him watching him do this right. And then the elephant in itself, the elephant, right? The biggest person in the room with who has the power to hold so much water in his trunk could literally bring up that water and help out but he didn't do it. He thought it was futile, right? What's the point he's gonna burn out anyway? But you know, the hummingbird meant to say why they asked 200 Why do you keep doing he said because it's all i got is all I can do. You know, a little bit that I can do. And that's what I feel about rising Rouse. You know, there's organizations environmental organizations that are large that are huge that billions of dollars that have I've just been actually given I won't say the name. And they refuse to bring these three Nexus together, you know, this nexus between environmental stewardship, social justice, and mental health, you know, because it is a mental health thing, right? It's a behavioral change that we have to have, at some point to be engaged in this environmental issue that is predominantly white. Because you know, we don't trust our state, or our governments, we don't trust, environmental or, again, have led this initiative, and haven't included or have historically excluded bipod, black conditioners and people of color. And so for me, this is an opportunity as a black man to step up and to do what's necessary for my communities first in Colorado, in Denver, like, and then move outside nationally and do it for the world.

20:54  
It's so powerful, because, you know, like you said, there's a lot of money going into privilege places. And then we know we talk a lot about, well, how come people of color don't care about the environment? No, we care. We're not in that space. And we're not the ones that people give money to, you know, Jeff Bezos, if you're listening, you know, you're at $791 million, given out to 16 different groups who are at the top, who are mostly white LED organizations who aren't doing the same thing that people on the ground are doing. So Jeff Bezos, if you want to give that money to a place where it actually will do some really good for the people at the bottom, who are working with communities who are really trying to do something, feel free to give it to rise and rise and other organizations, that's

21:34  
I'm gonna say, our learning requires a different type of approach is not the same as you know, traditionally, white communities, our approach needs a different type, it needs to be transformative. Mm hmm. And it needs to be able to deal with the social issues that we have, right? In justices that we have to even get to that Maslow's hierarchy of needs of self actualization. You know what I mean? Well, we every day, you know, you've heard this 1000 times on every day, you're struggling to put food on your table and try to take care of your family and water and all the things the basic needs that we have we worried about climate change, but we need to be worried about it. Because what affects water? What affects food? What if our safety and security well, climate change affects all of that. So it's not at the top of the hierarchy of needs, it's not a bash realization is actually at the very bottom. So we need to make sure that our communities are aware of that, and they need to be more civically engaged. And our education has failed us in so many ways. And I don't mean to keep talking, but man, I just see it as they have failed us. And purposely, I mean, again, if you were taught about how our government how even your local government, how it worked either for you or against you, then you would probably do everything you can to change it, because your family and your children would be affected. And so we're just trying to bring it back to the communities here and bring it back to them to so they can make these changes and they can feel empowered. You talk about justice, you're

23:09  
talking about healing human well being, you talk about the environment. How do you actually do that, though, at rising routes? Like, is that something you're still figuring out? Or are you have you figured out the equation?

23:22  
You know, we have, let me say this, we are continually working on it. We are so close to that, you know, it's so close to launching and putting our vision out there, right and putting our mission out there and how we're going to accomplish it. But right now we are working in partnership with you. Which Thank you, of course, figure out our programming, in addition to some other partners that have come in just recently,

23:54  
they want to give a check. not mad at it. I'm not mad

23:57  
at a cheque. And I'm excited about the opportunity of what that's going to do for us not just now but for this year in 2021. But I can tell you just the gist of it. Yeah, please, I can tell you that it's going to incorporate different cultures, different backgrounds, different experiences, different distance. These are going to be able to convene together and my idea of a luxury setting, right? I want you to feel so comfortable and so relaxed to where in the mountains or in some fairy tale land, right? One, you can be connected back to the land and connect it back to Mother Nature, where it's going to give you every benefit that you can think about. And that's where I want to be able to facilitate those conversations, guide it through our programming where you can learn more about how you can be a better advocate not only for yourself, people Yeah, get away from that Western individualism and start worrying about other people problems as well. That's right, and then we can be able to share our ideas and ultimately create some collective understanding of what problems do we, you know, like really look at ourselves and figure out what has the system has done one to our own understanding, right? What do we need to unlearn? And how has the system either contributed to our own lives or the lives of our community and the lives of other people as well? And how can we figure out collectively that your issue is my issue, your problem is my problem, right, and then figure out what we need to do to address those problems once we've created exactly what those issues are, and then take next steps. Because empathy without action is useless. Make sure that not only do we talk about it, and we empathize with people, and we understand but we take collective action together to solve these issues.

25:52  
And so this is all going to be done, of course, in an outdoor space, and, uh, you know, like you said, luxurious, and I, you know, I think for some people like, oh, luxurious, it's gonna be a spa is gonna be like, you know, buffet is gonna be amazing. I can't wait for this luxurious experience. Banana, you mean, luxurious, because nature in itself is luxurious. If you get out into it,

26:14  
exactly. We I don't want you to thinking, you know, that the biggest thing is that, and my business partner will attest to a lot of this is that, you know, we don't want to necessarily continue to perpetuate capitalism. And consumerism is something that is inherently has been destructive to our own communities for quite some time. So we want to figure out exactly how can we rewrite that narrative that looks different? You know, how can people that participate become maybe owners or employee own? You know, something, in some sense? How can we put money back into the communities that needed the most, you know, or how can we make this retreat? affordable? Is there some form of reparations, right? Just think outside of the box. I'm just tired of people always continually. They've done what they've done before, it's always been okay to do it that way. And it's just something that has always been good, but in the same instance, it has pushed, and people have been stepped on and smashed, you know, because of those issues. And so policies and whatnot, I want to do it differently. Yeah. And I don't know quite what that looks like yet. But, but believe me, you will see it.

27:25  
Yeah. Well, you

27:26  
know what, though, you might remember, this is my, you know, I love when I finally said this to you? Because I was like trying is like what? How do I tell him this and not be awkward? I was like, All I care about is you being successful when you asked me to be a part of your board. I wasn't like, Oh, this is gonna turn into a moneymaker. And I didn't know what rising house was, I didn't know enough about it to say I know for sure this is definitely understand gonna work. But I believed in you. Period, that's the period. And then I believe in the possibilities of what could be, because you can't possibly know what's going to be the solution. We don't know what's going to fix these issues that we have in this planet. I mean, there's a lot going on. And we really need everyone, everyone has a role to play and healthy communities and a healthy planet. And you cannot squash innovation, if you do it, it may lead to us being set back even further on this trajectory of a dying planet. So what can we do together, it's going to take some individuals who just you know, you may not understand what they're trying to do, you may not understand how it's gonna work, but you got to give it space, let it grow. Let the seed grow, put it in good soil, you that's your only job on this planet is to put good soil around seeds. If you're not doing that, what are you doing?

28:43  
Boy, I mean, you just said there, you just said it. You know, again, it goes back to capitalism, you want things fast, quick, you want to in a hurry, and you sit back and just really think about, alright, let's think outside of the box, I keep saying that, like literally let's continue to to aggregate these issues. And these problems go let's think about something different. You know, and if it takes time, it takes time, right? I don't care to rush to put a product out there just so I can make money. That's not important to me. My ultimate goal is to ensure that I'm making lasting change, hopefully, we will never need another rising route, right? This is going to come in is going to do what it needs to do. And this is going to spread like wildfire. And I worry about it no more. That's right. And ultimately, that's what I want to be able to create and a view about making lasting change in your community. But not just for yourself. But for other people as well. I think Brian Rouse is a great place to come on board and start figuring out how can I be a part of this? Right. So that's that.

29:40  
And so let's talk for a second. Let's take it back for a moment here because you said you know, you had an incident with a copy. You got eight years in finance. So everyone's like, Wait a second, is he not a conservationist? Does he really love nature? Like how did you get into this idea of nature and conservation? Like how do you feel about those terms?

29:59  
Yeah. Well, how did I get into it was a matter of me just looking for a second home outside of Nebraska, no offense Cornhuskers. But you know, I needed to find more nature because I just enjoy traveling and whatnot and just enjoy being out there that visited Colorado before. But once I got out here, and I really experienced the peace, love and equanimity, of Mother Nature that it provided you it was healing, because of that experience that I had in Nebraska that really set me back and woke me up to the disparities of the judicial system. When I came to Colorado and started hiking and backpacking and snowshoeing and so forth and so forth. I felt so at peace, I felt like that's where it was just me and my thoughts. It was just me and my issues and my problems. And I was able to address them because they used to come up so frequently. It's almost like meditation, right? When you go and you really sit and you breathe, and you inhale and exhale. And you do that for a good hour. 1000s of things come up in your mind.

31:02  
In the eye journal, I read my journal out and actually sit by if I can find a rock by a river, you will find me sitting on it in my journal writing.

31:10  
Mm hmm. It's like Outdoor Journal. I think there's a company out of Atlanta, if not mistaken by two women in Bay or so just look them up. But anyways, oh, what's the name of it again, Outdoor Journal, okay. And they do that they take people on heights, and they journal and it's a great experience. I've had a pleasure to meet with them. And two great CEOs that I think a change maker in the in this industry. But again, once I moved out here I delve everything I could into the outdoors, I went hiking, once or twice a week, I would join Colorado Mountain Club and was able to just learn about safety, learn about Colorado terrain, which is very dynamic, and was able to just learn how to survive and outdoors. And once I learned that, I figured I needed to start protecting it to why I didn't just love something so much. Right. You know, what is good is giving you so much peace, so much joy, you're gonna want to protect it. Yeah, in essence, that's why, you know, even rising routes, that portion of environmental stewardship came into play, because I couldn't imagine taking people outdoors if I wasn't trying to protect it, because it's in danger. Right. Right. Yeah. So that's essentially how I got into it. And you know, I met some great, great, great, great, great environmentalists here in Colorado. I don't have any issues with the word conservation. I know you was mentioning that earlier. I mean, I know a lot of people do it doesn't sit right with you know, if I would have asked my auntie This is something that Tasha Adams, she's the Commissioner of Colorado Parks and Wildlife and the outdoor Astro, policy director and the CO leader for for Colorado here for outdoor air for love Etosha. She tells me all this all the time, like conservation, preservation, what In other words, and environmentalism, all these words to to bipoc are black confusions people of color, like to keep saying that out loud, is that, you know, how can you get it to where it's culturally relevant? How can you get this language to be culturally relevant to our communities? Because right now, you know, my ta understanding all that, just like she would say, That's right. To understand that my cousin, cousin, cousin, cousin don't understand that, like he, you know, yeah.

33:29  
This is life, that's not

33:30  
his life, you know, you may ask them what conservation mean. And maybe like, for me growing up, what that meant was like, you know, you use that high grease in your cooking that you say that hot grease, and all that flavor for the next meal.

33:43  
Yeah. Right. And that's conservation. And that is conservation for people.

33:49  
Yeah, every part of the pig, like when you slaughtered a pig and, or something like that, you would use every part of it. You didn't let anything go to waste. Just little things like that, you know?

34:00  
Yeah, you know, and I love that expression. I mean, I like you said, there's so much wrapped up in words sometimes. But at the end of the day, we all need to get there somehow. And if it's not to the vehicle of the word conservation, or preservation, or whatever the word is you'd like to use, that doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. only thing that matters is getting people to the table. And I think rising Rouse is once again, another vehicle to get people to that table, create that table, not get them to the table, create a new table, where they are welcome and they feel comfortable. And I really love just everything, that ethos, everything that is the possibility of rising routes. You're not just soaking in like everything is bad and horrible. And I'm so sad about the planet. I'm so sad about racial injustice. I'm so sad about the lack of good mental health in this country. Let's do something about it. People. Let's not just sit around thinking about it. Let's put some action in there.

34:54  
So true. It's so true. It's just like if you hear what the Andrew just said, and you've been thinking A lot about how do I even get involved? How do I start to participate even if it's just a little bit there are so many Coalition's not only in Colorado, but I got to imagine throughout the country, there are so many Coalition's so many meetings, so many places and ways to get engaged in this, honestly. But we need to be able to make it relevant to you, we need to be able to make sure that culturally, you understand that how it impacts your community and how it impacts your world. And once we figure that out, then we can start laying those foundations to get you involved. And I think that's where that intersection starts to become more prevalent. As we convene, with rising routes with different types of people. Again, we're starting to ideate exactly what those issues are in our communities or just individually in ourselves, and then putting action plans in place to get it done.

35:55  
I love it. And you know what, this is gonna be the year for rising rounds, y'all Give me the right kind of product that you want to give to these people who are really, you know, invested in what you all are offering in the outdoors, as well as for their well being their mental health as well as trying to heal the planet and communities. And so I'm looking forward to this year 2021, and what rising Ross is going to offer. And so I just want to say as we wrap up here, I want to find out more from you like where can people find out more about you and your organization? Where do you want to plug out there?

36:24  
Yeah, people, please don't sleep on me. This, this is happening. And you know, whether you think so and not because it's taken a while to get here is happening. And I'm excited about it. And if you want to get plugged in to rising routes, go to rise, your routes.com rise eros.com it will be the place where you can be able to sign up, put your information in and you know, continue to be a part of newsletter, you can go to rising routes on Facebook, which is obviously there or you can go to rise and route on Instagram. So we have all the platforms soon to be rising routes on Twitter. Nice. And personally, if you want to check out my personal journey I do enjoy journaling via Facebook. People have told me I'm a good writer, but you know, whatever I live in I embrace it. Jason That's right. Just embrace it. You can find me under Jason underscore g underscore Swan swa n n and you can follow me there. Wow,

37:23  
I am. So please, this was such an amazing session with you, Jason and I really just I'm so thankful for you to be on this planet. Whoever put you in this world. Thank you. I am so thankful because we love you Mama. Because now you have a lot to offer and you know whether you see in yourself or not doesn't matter. You're gonna do it anyways. Yeah, so world Watch out Jason Swan rising routes, they all come in for you. Get your company Ready, start getting all that money set aside to go home or you know, send your company employees on all this rising route stuff, whatever you got to do. Take your own personal time, get on that rising route. Get on that program. This is going to be great for you.

38:04  
Yes. Thank you so much for having me. Leanna. I really appreciate you as always. Absolutely, man.

38:09  
All right. Talk to you next time. Yes. Thank you for joining me during that amazing interview. I hope you learned something that you can bring back to your family, your friends, your co workers and to your community members. I invite you to learn more about me and our guests at the green mind podcast.com I can't wait to have you join me during the next interview. In the meantime, go enjoy nature in a way that is uniquely you. See ya

Transcribed by https://otter.ai